November
16th 2011
Posted under Conservatism
“I’m an American first, black second, conservative third.” ~ Herman Cain
Cain is onto something. While conservatism has become an abstract ideology (a la movement conservatism and neoconservatism), concern for one’s own people is grounded in blood and ancestry. What could be more concrete and visceral?
Still, there remains a double standard. Imagine if Mitt Romney said: “I’m an American first, white second, conservative third.” European Americans are not allowed to care for their own.
IanH on 16 Nov 2011 at 6:55 am #
Just when I thought Cain couldn’t get any more bizarre.
rjp on 16 Nov 2011 at 4:13 pm #
I think he just told us something to which everyone should listen.
He is American,
he is black,
and
then
he is conservative.
In other words, race trumps value system.
Matt Weber on 16 Nov 2011 at 4:30 pm #
I think it’s more that when white people say they’re pro-white, they sound like supremacists or nazis. There have been black supremacist groups, but they’ve never had any power to do anything. That historical baggage is hard to get rid of, especially with White Nationalists running around being as stereotypical as possible.
Savrola on 16 Nov 2011 at 6:17 pm #
Race should trump values systems.
Julian on 16 Nov 2011 at 6:47 pm #
“I think it’s more that when white people say they’re pro-white, they sound like supremacists or nazis.”
When whites move out of a neighborhood after blacks and browns move in (an implicitly pro-white action) does that make them seem like Nazis?
“There have been black supremacist groups, but they’ve never had any power to do anything.”
Have you been following what has happened to whites in South Africa since the end of Apartheid (or in Zimbabwe)?
“White Nationalists running around being as stereotypical as possible.”
Do you read any WN or pro-white sites? Or is your knowledge of them only superficial and stereotypical?
Matt Weber on 16 Nov 2011 at 8:25 pm #
Julian, I’m not saying there is no bias against whites. There is, usually because of their implied status as Eternal Oppressor. However, if you run around saying you are pro-white you will sound like a KKK member or a nazi. End of story. You can either deal with that and find ways around it or rail at the heavens. And no, blacks or browns will not have the same stigma. The playing field is not level. Let’s employ that superior white intelligence to find ways around this rather than just complaining and becoming as reactionarily stereotypical as we can be.
If blacks were in charge of the world as whites were in the past, I’m sure they’d behave no better. But they never have been, and so what goes on in Zimbabwe has little relevance to what happens in America. And in any case, Zimbabwe pales in comparison to what happened in Nazi Germany. If you want to play the historical blame game, you’ll lose every time. So don’t do it.
C Bowen on 17 Nov 2011 at 1:14 am #
Sav.;
Then Cain is a liar by his own admission.
He has never made the argument that “Mexican/South American” immigration is bad for the black man; he is never made the argument that legalizing drugs, segregation, and, particularly, the feminist version of a welfare state and the FICA tax is an assault on the American black man.
Nevertheless–you clearly get the point to make, which others seem to miss.
Kirt Higdon on 17 Nov 2011 at 1:55 am #
If race automatically trumps values system, what is there to discuss? If race “should” trump values system (and frankly it should not), then race is itself something that can be valued above all other values or at the other end considered not very important. In either case or any in between, it is up to each person how much he wants to value his race.
Julian on 17 Nov 2011 at 2:11 am #
Matt, the left controls the culture. I agree they (and those who don’t know any better) will use terms like Nazi whenever they can. Part of the way around that is calling them on their lies and demagoguery; speaking truth to power. Accepting their premises and playing by their rules isn’t going to get us anywhere.
There are the Alex Linders of the world; that is true. But when I read, say, Hunter Wallace (not really a WN) or Matt Parrott, among others, I don’t think I’m reading guys who would send people to camps or worse if given the chance.
You also seem to be forgetting the salient fact that whites are headed for minority status in the USA. It was one thing to let ourselves be browbeaten by myths like ‘white guilt’ when we were 90% of the population, it is something else entirely to put up with it when we are 60 some percent and falling fast. At what point are we to explicitly take our own side?
I won’t let the small percentage of nutty WNs, the lies and demagoguery of leftists or the squeamishness of many on right determine my thoughts and feelings on these issues.
Savrola on 17 Nov 2011 at 3:14 pm #
Kirt, while enjoying your splendid isolation sometime, take a moment to consider the concept of race as extended family.
Putting the interests of your third cousin before your political party, may be a struggle down a slippery slope for the classical liberal.
Savrola on 17 Nov 2011 at 3:16 pm #
Julian, you haven’t been around the internets long, have you?
Kirt Higdon on 17 Nov 2011 at 3:45 pm #
Savrola, I don’t even know my third cousins, let alone what their interests are and I don’t have a political party. The idea that Bush, Perry, Biden, Clinton, Gingrich, etc. are part of my “extended family” and that therefore I owe them something above my obligations to any human being just because they’re white is a rather silly position. I supported Ron Paul and Chuck Baldwin in the last election not because they’re white or family or of my political party but because they promoted values which are important to me. For the same reason I support Ron Paul in the present election cycle.
Savrola on 17 Nov 2011 at 6:12 pm #
Kirt if acting in your own self-interest works for you, great.
the chairman said, the “I’s have it.”
Julian on 18 Nov 2011 at 8:22 am #
Savrola, perhaps not as long as some here.
rjp on 18 Nov 2011 at 5:02 pm #
“There have been black supremacist groups, but they’ve never had any power to do anything.”
Stopped voters from going to the polls Philadephia.
Whole areas of every major American city where whites dare not go because they are black hell holes.
Infiltrated government in every city they in which they reside in significant numbers and taken over an even more significant portion of the government jobs.
Jacksons & Rainbow Push shook down Anheuser-Busch for City Beverage (City of Chicago A-B distributorship).
Shook the federal government down for $1.2 billion for “farmer” discrimination.
They have no power?
We could spend all day listing the scams they have pulled off but groups looking out for blacks have no power?
Savrola on 18 Nov 2011 at 6:00 pm #
I think you fail to distinguish between hustlers like Jackson and Co. and those racialists interested in gaining power.
Matt Weber on 18 Nov 2011 at 6:44 pm #
I guess “infiltrated” now means being voted in.
Sometimes I get the feeling that a lot of rightists don’t think that the West is actually in charge of the world.
Savrola on 18 Nov 2011 at 10:06 pm #
Black Power does not exist, no.
Shaming middle-class religious whites into subsidizing the current black lifestyle, can in no wise be called an exercise in power.
Julian on 19 Nov 2011 at 5:36 am #
Matt, if you haven’t already, you may want to familiarize yourself with the idea of ‘Black Run America’ (BRA). Both Paul Kersey (Stuff Black People Don’t Like) and Hunter Wallace (Occidental Dissent) have written widely on it.
Aaron on 20 Nov 2011 at 2:04 pm #
Matt Weber’s making a lot of sense here. Like it or not, whites are not a nation or even an ethnie as are African-Americans. “White” is not the reverse of “black.” Like it or not, “pro-white” is generally interpreted as “anti-black,” “anti-Latino,” etc. Most people won’t pay attention long enough for you to explain otherwise.
White nationalists are welcome to continue speaking their own private language, as they have been for over half a century. After all, it’s gotten them such wide mainstream influence so far.
Aaron on 20 Nov 2011 at 2:12 pm #
By the way, I’ve read Matt Parrott and those other people that Julian named. Matt Parrott is the only smart white nationalist in existence. (Well, if Richard Spencer labels himself a white nationalist, then he’s the other one.) By smart, I don’t just mean scholarly-smart like Kevin MacDonald, I mean also clued in to the real world. If you had ten thousand Matt Parrotts, you might have a real movement instead of a circus sideshow.
Bruce on 21 Nov 2011 at 12:01 pm #
I haven’t figured out who’s a white nationalist and who isn’t. E.g. Jared Taylor? White nationalist or not? Smart, or not?
Julian on 21 Nov 2011 at 6:44 pm #
“Like it or not, whites are not a nation or even an ethnie as are African-Americans. “White” is not the reverse of “black.” Like it or not, “pro-white” is generally interpreted as “anti-black,” “anti-Latino,” etc.”
Who decided this? And it is like a weather front, right? Nothing can be done to change it.
Regarding who is smart, I’d say that Aaron is certainly the smartest pretend paleo-con I’ve read.
Bruce on 21 Nov 2011 at 6:58 pm #
Aaron isn’t a pretend paleocon. He’s a neocon-paleocon ecumenist.
Bruce on 21 Nov 2011 at 7:01 pm #
Just to be clear, in the above I’m asking Aaron if he considers Taylor a WNist or not and, if so, does he think Taylor is “smart” or not smart.
Aaron on 25 Nov 2011 at 2:40 pm #
Bruce, sorry about not answering right away, but I don’t think Jared Taylor describes himself as white nationalist. He calls himself a race realist instead. Either way – a very smart guy.
Aaron on 25 Nov 2011 at 2:43 pm #
Julian, nobody decides what group does or does not become a nation.
Obviously, nations come into and out of existence all the time. White Americans might be a nation or ethnie in a few decades, but they’re not now. They’re a race.