Posted under Christianity & Culture & Israel & Media & Political Correctness
The manufactured controversy over White House correspondent Helen Thomas’ comments regarding Israel is somewhat amusing. She’s certainly no stranger to controversy, but it’s very telling that these particular comments led to her “immediate retirement.” To offend the Israeli elite in America is to commit an unforgivable sin. This goes without saying. The press corps can’t afford to tolerate someone like Thomas.
While I believe it’s impossible to uproot Israel and reverse what happened in 1948, it is indeed refreshing to hear such a challenge to the Zionist orthodoxy in Washington. To even question history like this is to invite great wrath as we have seen with those who sympathize with the “Lost Cause” or the non-interventionist movements of both World Wars. Even contemporary observations of Israeli culture are off-limits.
Culturally speaking, the vast majority of Jews in Israel are essentially European. It’s not hard to imagine why their neighbors hate them when you consider that Israel is nothing more than a throwback to European colonialism. You will not find another nation in the Middle East where secular humanism is so embedded. All of this would likely surprise most Americans if they actually bothered to educate themselves.
Equally sad is how American Evangelicals have allowed themselves to be exploited by bad theology (i.e., dispensationalism) where they provide unwavering, knee-jerk support for the Israeli state. Having spent much of my youth in dispensationalist circles, these folks really believe that the Israelis are building the Kingdom of God on earth. I would say they are exploited in the same way that blacks are exploited by the Democratic Party.
Roger on 08 Jun 2010 at 12:54 am #
The lesson that liberal Democrats draw from this incident:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-fauntroy-phd/if-helen-thomas-then-why_b_603775.html
This is unsurprising given that the Democrats, even more so than Republicans, are beholden to Jewish donors.
RonL on 08 Jun 2010 at 6:31 am #
Thomas was not attacking Israeli policy, she was calling for the Destruction of an ally of the United States. That’s not acceptable for any group. Her Third Wordlist position delegitimizes not only Israel, but also all settler nations, including the United States. Helen Thomas’s position may come from her being Lebanese, but it is not limited to the Levant. Her position undermines the legitimacy America, Canada, Australia, and New Zeeland. The logical and consequential corollary of “Europeans Go Home” is the basis of the Aztlan movement in the American southwest, a group, which also strongly supports the Palestinians.
So just remember that in attacking the “Israel Lobby” here, you delegitimize America.
Ernest on 08 Jun 2010 at 8:29 am #
“”she was calling for the Destruction of an ally of the United States.”"
Israel is an ally to American money, military support/American blood and nothing else.
“”So just remember that in attacking the “Israel Lobby” here, you delegitimize America.”"
Funny stuff, you should go on tour.
Captainchaos on 08 Jun 2010 at 10:27 am #
Damn, does that mean you are a White Nationalist, Ronnie? Why do all the rest of your kinsman need to give us so much shit over what they themselves do? They must realize that if the White race is mongrelized out of existence (and in effect ceases to exist) that they themselves will be fucked.
Yup, I’m sure the Chinese will be as sympathetic towards (take as much bullshit from) Jews as whitey does (LOL!).
RedPhillips on 08 Jun 2010 at 11:28 am #
Ron, I my mind the issue isn’t so much what she said, as the reaction to it. Helen Thomas, love her or hate her, was a respected and venerable member of the White House press corp. Her school speech was canceled. Her agent dropped her. And she was forced to retire. This is ruthlessly efficient thought policing. Any of us who do not march in lock step with PC groupthink should be concerned about her silencing.
Augustinian on 08 Jun 2010 at 1:20 pm #
Stonewall,
Brilliant analysis! Hear! Hear!
Sean Scallon on 08 Jun 2010 at 3:05 pm #
One would have thought that consideration for Thomas’ views, no doubt shaped by her Lebanese ancestry, would have merited her at least an understanding. Nope, not today and not in the U.S.
RonL on 08 Jun 2010 at 6:33 pm #
Ernest,
Whether Israel is or is not an ally of the US is quite debatable. Israel has lost considerable blood for American goals and in defference to the US it still sits on its behind and Iran openly develops nuclear weapons to destroy it (and the US).
You ignore my point that delegitimizing any settler nation, undermines all. But you have no answer to this.
Captain Chaos,
Importing Muslims into Europe is explicitly against any rational Jewish interest. And you may have missed Stephen Stienlight’s piece on immigration in the US. http://www.cis.org/ChangingDemography-JewishInterestImmigrationPolicy
The leftist JEwish establishment literally refuse to allow him to debate or hold forums at synagogues.
Red,
Look around the world and US campuses and tell me again that supporting Israel is PC.
Sean,
So should we allow MExican indians to call for the destruction of the United States and try to understand them?
Dr Bob on 08 Jun 2010 at 8:33 pm #
In no way do I agree with what she said, but I will defend her right to say it.
To do otherwise is to walk in lockstep with the PC Police.
Gerry T. Neal on 09 Jun 2010 at 12:17 am #
In the old days, if someone said something you didn’t like, or even something absolutely outrageous that no sensible person could be expected to sympathize with, you called them names or ridiculed them or you sat down and wrote out a detailed refutation of them. You did not seek their personal and professional destruction.
That has changed.
RonL has two excellent points. The first is the parallel between the situation of European based countries like the United States or my own Canada, and that of Israelites in the Middle East. One who saw such a parallel was French writer Jean Raspail. Note the role of Israel in his “The Camp of the Saints”. The second is that support for Israel cannot be considered PC if by PC we mean the orthodoxy on leftist campuses and among leftist governments around the world. The orthodoxy there is almost universally pro-Palestinian.
Having said that, there is another kind of political correctness. This kind defines certain views as being beyond the pale and seeks the complete ruin of anyone who takes those views. This is a very disturbing move away from the give and take, free exchange of ideas, that used to be taken for granted as the norm in Anglo-based societies. The organizations most notorious for using this kind of politically correct tactic, in the United States and Canada, are groups like the Anti-Defamation League of the Binai B’rith and the Canadian Jewish Congress.
Helen Thomas’ remarks were foolish. Do they really require her professional and personal destruction in retaliation? Have we really become that thin-skinned that we can even consider answering that question with a “yes”?
Matt Weber on 09 Jun 2010 at 4:21 am #
I don’t know about personal destruction, but Thomas seemed a tad senile on this subject. Get the hell out of Israel and go back to Poland and Germany? I think retirement might have been the right idea, though PC thuggery was probably a factor. It’s amazing that people have gotten so worked up over this.
Ernest on 09 Jun 2010 at 10:57 am #
“”It’s amazing that people have gotten so worked up over this.”"
Exactly and that is the point. Who gives two leaps about Helen Thomas? Just who in the hell is she that her comments are so earth shattering and far reaching? But the reaction and amount of press on this show just exactly who drives the boat in the US. It shows how warped the thinking is as many get all abothered about the continuation and protection of Israel even as our own nation is being destroyed and in no small part with help from the Jews. Israel and most Jews could care less about the preservation of the US as a white ethno state, our culture or anything else that directly effect my family and community. In fact they work hard to see that multiculturalism is entrenched everywhere but in Israel.
John S on 11 Jun 2010 at 9:54 pm #
Taki Mag may be going downhill fast, but occasionally it still publishes a worthwhile artilce — like this clear-eyed take on the Helen Thomas business:
http://www.takimag.com/article/helen_thomas_overblown_israel_affair/
The point: by taking such umbrage at the fact that she even dared to express such comments, the neocons cleverly deflected attention away from discussing the *content* of her statement.
Bruce on 12 Jun 2010 at 8:39 pm #
I knew they would get her. For decades she blasted Republicans and the media elites loved her. For eight years she critisized George Bush and they loved her even more. One comment about Israel or the Jews and Helen is gone ! In any society whomever you can not critisize is who is really in charge. The man who asked Helen’s opinion and stuck a camera in her face was a rabbi.
How did I know the Israeli first crowd would get her ? I knew when Obama spoke of keeping the Middle-East free of nuclear weapons and only Helen Thomas was brave enough to ask if that meant Israel too. Jewish Americans illegally smuggled over 1,000 pounds of highly enriched plutonium from NUMEC in Pennsylvania back in the 1960′s. Mordicai Vannunu, a Christian Jew is currently in prison in Israel for producing photos of the Israeli nuclear plant at Dimona. Israel kidnapped him in Rome and illegally kept Vannunu in jail for 18 years for proving what we already knew.
JFK threatened to stop all military aid to Israel in October,1963 , unless they abandoned their nuclear weapons program. How did that work out for him ? Jack Ruby had worked for the Mossad before as a sweeper. He cleaned up loose ends for their hit teams. His birth certificate does not list his last name as Ruby but as Rubenstein. Hmmmmmm…………….
So now what investigative reporter is going to question Obama about Israel’s illegal nukes ? Woodward and Bernstein ? Wolf Blitzer who wrote for the Jerusalem Post for 17 years and wrote a very sympathetic biography of Jonathan Pollard, the Jewish spy who caused the death of every double agent we had in Eastern Europe when he stole 800,000 pages of top secret Pentagon papers ?
Those papers went to his handler, Eitan who gave them to his boss who traded our war plans in case NATO was attacked, to the Soviets in return for larger emigration quotas for Soviet Jews. That boss was Benyamin Bibi Netanyahu who formerly lived in America.
He is on tape telling his mistress during his second or third marriage,” America is like a big tube of toothpaste. We will squeeze all we can get out of her and then discard her.”
Sleep well.
Believer on 13 Jun 2010 at 11:05 pm #
Apparently every comment on Helen Thomas missed her point, Her
point is that Israel is in Palestine not because of Gods intervention
but because Jews stole the land. The Jews are the only race in history who were driven from their land 2000 years ago and kept their National Identity, Helen Thomas’ unbelief nor the worlds unbelief will not change God’s word. So rather than make this an issue of freedom of speach accept this as Biblical prophesy coming
to pass right before your eyes, read the 36th chaptor of Ezekiel among others. God’s word says that he would take them out of every corner of the world and return them to their own land, so
feel sorry for Helen not because she lost her job but because she lost her faith.
RonL on 15 Jun 2010 at 5:53 am #
Mr. Neal,
You are correct on free speech grounds. But that is not what has been argued.
Ernest,
Just where do you get the idea that liberal Jews don’t support multiculturalism for Israel. Most defend Israel, at least rhetorically, on the grounds that it is a liberal democracy. Israel is far too liberal. It has affirmative action for Arabs. Labour instituted a curriculum that denigrated Jewish religious ties to Israel, wrote Religious Zionism out of textbooks, and gave the Arab narrative of the “Nakba”, the creation of Israel. Israeli universities are run by the same left as in America and they are openly undermining it. There is no nationalist TV or radio station, and Arutz 7/Israel National News exists only because the Netanyahu administration refuses to enforce the political dictates of the leftist Supreme Court.
Bruce,
Are you going to continue to propgate Richard Hansen’s coverup, that held Pollard responsible for passing on information outside of his access? He deserves to be in prison, but the CIA and FBI cya is pathetic.
Mordicai Vannunu is a traitor. Why do you think that Pollard should rot, but Vannunu should be free?
And blaming Israel for the assasination of a friend of Israel like JFK is borderline pathalogical. Only 1 kennedy died over the middle east, and he died at the hands of the Arab Sirhan Sirhan.
Making up quotes and attributing them to Netanyahu does not help your case.
Bruce on 15 Jun 2010 at 8:28 pm #
Ron L,
I did NOT make up any quotes. Just because you have not read it yet does not mean it does not exist. Another Netyanhu quote I use frequently to my Baptist friends was when he was asked about the support for Israel from Christian evangelicals. Netanyahu replied, ” They are scum but I’ll take their money .”
I have read that there are teams of computer geeks in Israel constantly monitoring the internet searching for anything negative about Israel,Zionism or the Jews. They attack anyone who speaks out against their viewpoint, especially if it is true.
The lies you told Ernest are even more outrageous. Israel is commiting ethnic genocide against the Palestinians now, today. This is not something that happened 65 years ago that we can not do anything about. Today’s holocaust is happening right now in Gaza and the oppressed have become the oppressors. Arabs who were born in the West Bank can never become citizens and thus can not vote in Israel. So much for your “so called democracy”. Jews can vote if they recently arrived from Russia but Arabs whose families have lived in the land for generations can not vote. Would you call the old South Africa regime where Whites could vote and Blacks could not a democracy too ?????
How can you claim Israel supports multiculturism when Jewish rabbis still refuse to marry a Jew to a nonJew ?
roho on 16 Jun 2010 at 8:00 pm #
Bruce……You hit the nail on the head!…….Bravo!!!
Dittos! Dittos! Dittos!
RonL on 16 Jun 2010 at 8:11 pm #
Bruce,
Fabricating another quote, only proves your contempt for the truth or some pathology on your part. Cite your quotes or retract them and get help.
“I have read that there are teams of computer geeks in Israel constantly monitoring the internet searching for anything negative about Israel,Zionism or the Jews. They attack anyone who speaks out against their viewpoint, especially if it is true.”
Is that an attempt at a Tu Quoque? You are trying to shut me up by claiing that I am an Israeli? I hate to tell you but I haven’t been to Israel in nearly 2 decades since my Bar Mitzvah. I am a New Yorker and it is easy to find out exactly who I am.
Moreover, ConservativeTimes is a poor choice for Israeli agents. It is ranked 362,643 in traffic by Alexa.com . If the goal is propoganda, why waste time on a site that almost no one goes to.
I spend time here becase I am searching for a New Fusion Conservatism for the 21st century, so I pay attention to Paleos.
“The lies you told Ernest are even more outrageous.”
Cite one or retract.
“Israel is commiting ethnic genocide against the Palestinians now, today. ”
Would that be the 1.2 Million living in Israel proper? Or the millions in Gaza, which Israel gave back to the Arabs? Or the West Bank, were Israel employs them? If by genocide you mean taht under Israeli control their health standards, life expectancy, wealth, went up and population triples, then you have no sense of the term.
“Today’s holocaust is happening right now in Gaza and the oppressed have become the oppressors.”
There is no mass murder. You are just using terms to slander Israelis and allay resudual guilt fo the holocaust. This is pathetic.
“Arabs who were born in the West Bank can never become citizens and thus can not vote in Israel. ”
Are they Palestinians, or not? Which is it? If they are, they are not Israeli citizens and should never vote.
“Jews can vote if they recently arrived from Russia but Arabs whose families have lived in the land for generations can not vote.”
Arabs living in Israel proper can and do vote. And most Arabs in the disputed territories are descended from the hundreds of thousands of Arabs, Circasians, Albanians etc who settled from 1890 to 1939 in higher numbers than Jews.
“Would you call the old South Africa regime where Whites could vote and Blacks could not a democracy too ?????”
The importations of non-indegenous Africans to South Africa was a tragedy. Native Africans were far better off under Afrikaner rule and white rule in Rhodesia than today.
And South Africa was an ally of Israel.
“How can you claim Israel supports multiculturism when Jewish rabbis still refuse to marry a Jew to a nonJew ?”
Are you dense? Reform and Reconstructionist Rabbus do marry non-Jews to Jews. Only Orthodox don’t.
Many Christian clerics won’t officiate over interfaith ceremonies. This is quite proper and says nothing about secular Israeli policy.
But by all means, continue to show your ignorance.
Bruce on 17 Jun 2010 at 5:18 pm #
Ron,
Are you claiming that I am crazy if you have not read a quote I used ?
Okay ,I will use a quote more common that even you will know.
” All the Arabs in the Middle-East are not worth the fingernail of one Jew ! ” I have read three other versions of this popular quote including Menachim Begin’s version where he only used a million Arabs instead of all the Arabs.I guess that is pr to clean up the Zionist image world wide. My question to you, Ron , is what Jew said it first or is another antisemitic quote I just made up ?
I believe this racist quote was first uttered by Rabbi Yaacov Perrin at the funeral of Brooklyn born MD, Dr Baruch Goldstein who entered a mosque and killed 29 Muslims as they prayed. He wounded 150 other Muslims before he was killed. He received his medical degree at Albert Einstein. He murdered the unarmed ,praying Muslims on Purim.
Another speaker at his funeral.Samuel Hacohen, called Dr. Golstein ,”the greatest Jew,perfect in everyway.”
Dr. Goldstein was buried with honors at Meir Kahane Park and a shrine was built. Today little Jewish children dress up like Baruch Goldstein to honor him.
You think I made this up ? I know many worse things I can tell……
But my original comment on this thread before only you basically called me a liar, was that there was a deliberate conspiracy to silence Helen Thomas because she dared to tell the truth about Israel’s hundreds of illegal nukes. I think you attacking me and my honesty proves my theory that to some Jews, Israel is above the law and may not be critisized by anyone. Really.
I give you facts, you call me names .How ignorant is that ?
RonL on 18 Jun 2010 at 3:46 am #
“Are you claiming that I am crazy if you have not read a quote I used ? ”
I can’t find it to source it.
“” All the Arabs in the Middle-East are not worth the fingernail of one Jew ! ” I have read three other versions of this popular quote including Menachim Begin’s version where he only used a million Arabs instead of all the Arabs.I guess that is pr to clean up the Zionist image world wide. My question to you, Ron , is what Jew said it first or is another antisemitic quote I just made up ?”
Actually, aside from people posting responses to articles, I can’t find anything like that by Begin. I’d love to see the full quote.
“I believe this racist quote was first uttered by Rabbi Yaacov Perrin at the funeral of Brooklyn born MD, Dr Baruch Goldstein who entered a mosque and killed 29 Muslims as they prayed. He wounded 150 other Muslims before he was killed. He received his medical degree at Albert Einstein. He murdered the unarmed ,praying Muslims on Purim.
Another speaker at his funeral.Samuel Hacohen, called Dr. Goldstein ,”the greatest Jew,perfect in everyway.””
Begin died in 1992. Goldstein’s actions were in February 1994. (I didn’t have to look it up, I remember the instance quite well.) So, what does this have to do with
Although the Goldstein case is more complex than most people understand, for argument, lets say the three are anti-Arab extremists. Wow, 3. Compared to 1 Billion + Muslims who think JEws are the descendants of Monkeys and Pigs and follow a “prophet” who butchered and raped his way through the Jewish communities of Arabia?
“But my original comment on this thread before only you basically called me a liar, was that there was a deliberate conspiracy to silence Helen Thomas because she dared to tell the truth about Israel’s hundreds of illegal nukes”
Try again. Thomas continued to promote the Arab line right until she called for the destruction of Israel. What don’t you understand?
“I think you attacking me and my honesty proves my theory that to some Jews, Israel is above the law and may not be critisized by anyone. Really.”
Does playing victim make you feel righteous? Because it is pretty close to what you attacks Israelis and Jews for. Is it projections or mimicry?
Bruce on 18 Jun 2010 at 9:10 pm #
No, neither, possibly disapointment. I was raised in a strict Christian home that was 100% pro-Israel. I corresponded with more than one Israeli prime minister concerning me emigrating to Israel. I outgrew my religious training but I am still very conservative politically. My heros are Pat Buchanan and Ron Paul.
I support Israel when they are right but they have been allowed to go to far . Like their invasion of Gaza last January before Bush left office. Not one Israeli had been killed by rockets in the preceding 12 months but Israel used that as an excuse to go into Gaza and kill 1400 Arabs, most were civilians.
I keep hearing how the Palestinians are using rockets and suicide bombers to kill the Jews but the kill ratio from 2000-2009 is over 250 Palestinians killed for every Jew killed. The raw numbers according to the UN are approximately 4,000 Palestians killed to 23 Jews killed. Why don’t we hear that on the MSM ? Could it be because the Palestinians don’t own our television networks,our newspaper chains, our news magazines, our radio networks, and our movie studios ?
Have you read Rep.Paul Findley’s book about how AIPAC controls our pentagon , our congress, and our state department. I don’t love the Arabs. I don’t want any country having that much control over our government, not Saudi Arabia, not China, not even Israel.
Ron, since we seem to be the only two people still on this thread , I can tell that you are an inteligent,well read individual and you made some great points. I don’t blame you for supporting your tribe.But I don’t want to see Israel drag America into WWIII and I believe we are headed in that direction. None of the Arab countries like us now because they know Israel’s weapons are bought and paid for by American $$$. Israel needs to reign in their aggression because they are becoming a liability to the US.
Best wishes,
Bruce